Comments on: The Magic Porridge Pot http://mindsalot.wordpress.com/2006/10/02/the-magic-porridge-pot-autistic-goverment/ Living and working with the human givens: News, comment, psychology, research and discussion Sat, 14 Nov 2009 11:13:13 +0000 http://wordpress.com/ hourly 1 By: harold mozley http://mindsalot.wordpress.com/2006/10/02/the-magic-porridge-pot-autistic-goverment/#comment-35 harold mozley Sat, 28 Oct 2006 14:09:06 +0000 http://mindsalot.wordpress.com/2006/10/02/the-magic-porridge-pot-autistic-goverment/#comment-35 Eleanor just noticed typos so this is as it should, please delete first post- sorry. From The Guardian October 28 2006: 'Town Gets Stuck in Semolina. The streets of Great Yarmouth were paved with semolina this week when more than two tonnes of the grain billowed out of a silo and scattered over the Norfolk town. First there was a fine dusting of the coarsely ground grain covering the area, but when the council workers tried to wash it with water, the sodden semolina turned into a gooey pudding mess. Blobs of the dessert clotted in corners and over kerbstones and caused a bit of chaos. John Hemsworth, the town's head of environmental health said:"It looked like there had been a heavy frost. It was like an ice rink. We had 10 to 15 people trying to clear it up, but as soon as it got wet it became more of a problem. First it got sticky , then slippy, and then it was dangerous for people to walk on, so we had to close off the pavements." ' Now I know Ivan tells a good story and metaphors are powerful things but when they come true like this... However in view of the discussion on the workings of bureaucracies here is the best bit. The story goes on: 'He (head of environmental health) added: "Then we had to get permission from the Environment Agency to put it in the river, then permission from Anglian Water to put it in the drains. It was all very complicated." ' I notice the little girl didn't get the necessary agency permissions so that proves it just a story Eleanor just noticed typos so this is as it should, please delete first post- sorry.

From The Guardian October 28 2006:
‘Town Gets Stuck in Semolina.
The streets of Great Yarmouth were paved with semolina this week when more than two tonnes of the grain billowed out of a silo and scattered over the Norfolk town.
First there was a fine dusting of the coarsely ground grain covering the area, but when the council workers tried to wash it with water, the sodden semolina turned into a gooey pudding mess. Blobs of the dessert clotted in corners and over kerbstones and caused a bit of chaos.
John Hemsworth, the town’s head of environmental health said:”It looked like there had been a heavy frost. It was like an ice rink. We had 10 to 15 people trying to clear it up, but as soon as it got wet it became more of a problem. First it got sticky , then slippy, and then it was dangerous for people to walk on, so we had to close off the pavements.” ‘

Now I know Ivan tells a good story and metaphors are powerful things but when they come true like this…
However in view of the discussion on the workings of bureaucracies here is the best bit. The story goes on:
‘He (head of environmental health) added:
“Then we had to get permission from the Environment Agency to put it in the river, then permission from Anglian Water to put it in the drains. It was all very complicated.” ‘

I notice the little girl didn’t get the necessary agency permissions so that proves it just a story

]]> By: Helen http://mindsalot.wordpress.com/2006/10/02/the-magic-porridge-pot-autistic-goverment/#comment-23 Helen Tue, 17 Oct 2006 10:32:29 +0000 http://mindsalot.wordpress.com/2006/10/02/the-magic-porridge-pot-autistic-goverment/#comment-23 Interesting concept. More like Roseanna I would have ticked the boxes for the [social] psychopath - with an incongruence that leaves you feeling that under the warm and charming surface is a cold inner core. I struggle with such an extensive list of autistic traits as I'm sure [like John above notes] many reading this article would be able to tick at least some of the boxes here, not least depending on the 'degree' to which they may be applied, and feel that generally there is too little research yet that looks at the interface/layering between autistic traits, ADHD and autism, to name but a few. Interesting concept. More like Roseanna I would have ticked the boxes for the [social] psychopath – with an incongruence that leaves you feeling that under the warm and charming surface is a cold inner core. I struggle with such an extensive list of autistic traits as I’m sure [like John above notes] many reading this article would be able to tick at least some of the boxes here, not least depending on the ‘degree’ to which they may be applied, and feel that generally there is too little research yet that looks at the interface/layering between autistic traits, ADHD and autism, to name but a few.

]]> By: john http://mindsalot.wordpress.com/2006/10/02/the-magic-porridge-pot-autistic-goverment/#comment-19 john Fri, 13 Oct 2006 12:56:20 +0000 http://mindsalot.wordpress.com/2006/10/02/the-magic-porridge-pot-autistic-goverment/#comment-19 Indeed we do need to understand .... and we need to do an awful lot more of that i think... but having worked with so many children who attract the diagnosis of 'autistic spectrum disorder' one can see how the so-called 'evidence' for autism might have been called/diagnosed as something different even a decade ago and would have led to a different response from professionals and carers. It's amazing just how many children now have 'mild ASD' (i.e. the diagnostic criteria have been constrcuted to allow so many more children to meet the thresholds) and apalling how this can forclose helpful reponses that might be utilised to respond to a particular child's unmet needs. Diagnosis as a form of abdicating responsibility - whether its towards a child or our own contribution as a citizen. Very neat and sometimes clever, but rarely helpful. One lens to look at a situation clearly can lead to a lot of MISunderstanding. And straight-line thinking might indeed be a LOT more common among the 'sane' than we think! Indeed we do need to understand …. and we need to do an awful lot more of that i think… but having worked with so many children who attract the diagnosis of ‘autistic spectrum disorder’ one can see how the so-called ‘evidence’ for autism might have been called/diagnosed as something different even a decade ago and would have led to a different response from professionals and carers. It’s amazing just how many children now have ‘mild ASD’ (i.e. the diagnostic criteria have been constrcuted to allow so many more children to meet the thresholds) and apalling how this can forclose helpful reponses that might be utilised to respond to a particular child’s unmet needs. Diagnosis as a form of abdicating responsibility – whether its towards a child or our own contribution as a citizen. Very neat and sometimes clever, but rarely helpful. One lens to look at a situation clearly can lead to a lot of MISunderstanding. And straight-line thinking might indeed be a LOT more common among the ’sane’ than we think!

]]> By: Barbara http://mindsalot.wordpress.com/2006/10/02/the-magic-porridge-pot-autistic-goverment/#comment-12 Barbara Wed, 11 Oct 2006 16:07:16 +0000 http://mindsalot.wordpress.com/2006/10/02/the-magic-porridge-pot-autistic-goverment/#comment-12 Our growing awareness of how relatively widespread autism is is incredibly important...the list just in the 20th century of suspected autistics is remarkable: Hitler, Einstein, Yeats, Joyce to name only a few. So we do need to understand this condition thoroughly--not to blame or pigeonhole, but because they are both opening up windows in art and science that are often extraordinary, and also shaping our lives into deadends where five-year plans and what Ivan has called 'straight-line' thinking rule. Our growing awareness of how relatively widespread autism is is incredibly important…the list just in the 20th century of suspected autistics is remarkable: Hitler, Einstein, Yeats, Joyce to name only a few. So we do need to understand this condition thoroughly–not to blame or pigeonhole, but because they are both opening up windows in art and science that are often extraordinary, and also shaping our lives into deadends where five-year plans and what Ivan has called ’straight-line’ thinking rule.

]]> By: john http://mindsalot.wordpress.com/2006/10/02/the-magic-porridge-pot-autistic-goverment/#comment-8 john Tue, 10 Oct 2006 09:15:12 +0000 http://mindsalot.wordpress.com/2006/10/02/the-magic-porridge-pot-autistic-goverment/#comment-8 ....but then again, sometimes we can fall foul of 'seeing what we want to see'.... an equally dangerous prospect in terms of sound mental health... you can loose perspective... you can begin to believe the proposterous idea that teh problems are all 'out there'... I wonder how many of the boxes we might tick about ourselves if we were honest enough?... diagnoses are merely constructs, not fixed realities which is certainly one of the reasons that there are (apparently) so many more people with Asbergers and ASD...let's not run away with good ideas let's USE them... not to pigeon-hole or pathologise but to find more effective ways of living our own lives in relationship with others ….but then again, sometimes we can fall foul of ’seeing what we want to see’…. an equally dangerous prospect in terms of sound mental health… you can loose perspective… you can begin to believe the proposterous idea that teh problems are all ‘out there’… I wonder how many of the boxes we might tick about ourselves if we were honest enough?… diagnoses are merely constructs, not fixed realities which is certainly one of the reasons that there are (apparently) so many more people with Asbergers and ASD…let’s not run away with good ideas let’s USE them… not to pigeon-hole or pathologise but to find more effective ways of living our own lives in relationship with others

]]> By: eleanor http://mindsalot.wordpress.com/2006/10/02/the-magic-porridge-pot-autistic-goverment/#comment-7 eleanor Mon, 09 Oct 2006 16:33:03 +0000 http://mindsalot.wordpress.com/2006/10/02/the-magic-porridge-pot-autistic-goverment/#comment-7 it is fascinating isn't it - once you know the list of autistic traits - you begin to see them everywhere, particularly in government. We are not the only ones to have recognised this, as Osbornes comments about Gordon Brown the other day indicate!!! it is fascinating isn’t it – once you know the list of autistic traits – you begin to see them everywhere, particularly in government.
We are not the only ones to have recognised this, as Osbornes comments about Gordon Brown the other day indicate!!!

]]> By: Rosanna webb http://mindsalot.wordpress.com/2006/10/02/the-magic-porridge-pot-autistic-goverment/#comment-6 Rosanna webb Mon, 09 Oct 2006 16:22:12 +0000 http://mindsalot.wordpress.com/2006/10/02/the-magic-porridge-pot-autistic-goverment/#comment-6 just read the artical about Blair and the magic porridge pot........totally brilliant, so pleased someone with standing had the guts to say this, yes i agree we have more mental illness because we are being forced to live in a way that goes gainst our human psychology and basic instincts. Very very interesting conection made about Blair and autisum, something i hadnt thought before, personally ive always suspected he might well tick all the right boxes for being a psyhopath. Intelligent, portrays him self as charming i ay portrays because as ivan said he speech is not spontaneous or natural and gives it away he doesnt actually mean what hes saying. (hence he pauses in the wrong place and emphises the wrong parts of sentences if he was genuinely speaking from the heart. ) As ivan said he does play to the audience, choosing a different role depending on who hes trying to convince. is concerened with advancing his own power. He obviously has no empathy or hint of understanding of how people feel. And appears to be incapable of feeling remorse at his actions. No matter how catestrophic the consequences. This list was not just purely a personal attack on blair but traits of a psychopath.........if the cap fits............... just read the artical about Blair and the magic porridge pot……..totally brilliant, so pleased someone with standing had the guts to say this, yes i agree we have more mental illness because we are being forced to live in a way that goes gainst our human psychology and basic instincts. Very very interesting conection made about Blair and autisum, something i hadnt thought before, personally ive always suspected he might well tick all the right boxes for being a psyhopath. Intelligent, portrays him self as charming i ay portrays because as ivan said he speech is not spontaneous or natural and gives it away he doesnt actually mean what hes saying. (hence he pauses in the wrong place and emphises the wrong parts of sentences if he was genuinely speaking from the heart. ) As ivan said he does play to the audience, choosing a different role depending on who hes trying to convince. is concerened with advancing his own power. He obviously has no empathy or hint of understanding of how people feel. And appears to be incapable of feeling remorse at his actions. No matter how catestrophic the consequences.
This list was not just purely a personal attack on blair but traits of a psychopath………if the cap fits……………

]]> By: Maria Farry http://mindsalot.wordpress.com/2006/10/02/the-magic-porridge-pot-autistic-goverment/#comment-5 Maria Farry Mon, 09 Oct 2006 15:57:17 +0000 http://mindsalot.wordpress.com/2006/10/02/the-magic-porridge-pot-autistic-goverment/#comment-5 Yes, I think TB's fixation with his own agenda, coupled with what appears to be a total indifference to and/or lack of insight into the views of the intelligent majority, would seem to confirm this idea. We are certainly being swamped in so many ways and people will, I believe, eventually panic. We could soon be facing civil war in this country. People's sense of self and their identity comes not just from immediate family but also from the society in which they live. If the primal need to feel at one with such society is absent, it has quite horrific implications for the future. Yes, I think TB’s fixation with his own agenda, coupled with what appears to be a total indifference to and/or lack of insight into the views of the intelligent majority, would seem to confirm this idea. We are certainly being swamped in so many ways and people will, I believe, eventually panic. We could soon be facing civil war in this country. People’s sense of self and their identity comes not just from immediate family but also from the society in which they live. If the primal need to feel at one with such society is absent, it has quite horrific implications for the future.

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